Are Admins Scared to Ban?

[Dasher]

Well, I've never banned an actual human member before (just spambots as of yet), though I'm sure I'd be a bit hesitant to do so.

Which brings me to the next thing that I most worry about. On larger forums (even bigger than FP) many admins go ban-crazy and people are banned for little reason at all. It's obvious these admins have been banning for a long time and that it has become practically a custom for them, which, while it may be necessary, seems a little sick to me.

They don't want to drop the bandruff.

 

[Battou]

I ain't afraid to ban no one...it's just when you process nearly a hundred bans in a single month the banning process get irritating.

 

[Nebulous]

Ive only banned people if they have done something that really deserved it and I had evidence and proper justifications to back it up.

 

[Fullmoon]

If your to scared to ban people then you shouldnt be an admin 😛

However some admins are ban happy and thats not right either 😕

 

[Black Angel]

I'm not..

Three strikes and you are out.

I've been dubbed "the nice admin" on my brother's forum, but I am also the primary executioner.

Those who cross me, and break the rules and think I won't do anything about it because I am nice, or afraid to do my job are proven wrong.

 

[xwadigg]

Im never scared to ban.

 

[Kino]

As an admin I'm not afraid to ban.

 

[Justin]

I am stern when the time cals for it but I also care about the users. I am not scared to ban. If I have a completly valid reason for banning that person than I will proceed to emal them with the reasons of the banning, ban length, and how to not get banned in the future.

If admins are scared to ban. They should be called moderators 😛

 

[Battou]

However some admins are ban happy

This is a serious lack of checks and balances, IMHO. The two Sites I admin the banning system paired with our logging protocols is such a pain in the ... , it prevents banhappyness. Unfortunately that also sort of promotes ban evasion at times when an admin is sick of going through the effort to ban a user for the umpteenth time :sad: .

 

[Fergal]

...The two Sites I admin the banning system paired with our logging protocols is such a pain...

How does that system work? What does an Admin have to do in order to ban someone?

 

[Shiny Star]

As there is like only two other admins, they do not do much, we do not need to ban, only banned one person and that was because of them posting non-erated pics.

 

[Violetstar]

I will only ban if it seems to be necessary and everyone voted for him/her to be..banned

You vote on whether to ban or not? Is this just amongst staff, or members too?

 

[Violetstar]

I will ban if I need to.

 

[froggyboy604]

I only ban people who post porn, virus, and fake drug links since it is pretty obvious that they won't come back to post something worth reading.

I never had to deal with a member that cursed a lot, or made threats to others.

But, I will ban someone if they do illegal things like promoting their spams, scams, and malware.

If it is a behavioral problem. I will PM them to stop, or risk being banned.

 

[Battou]

...The two Sites I admin the banning system paired with our logging protocols is such a pain...

How does that system work? What does an Admin have to do in order to ban someone?

...Well the initial banning process is not really too much different than the standard issue PHPbb2 banning protocols. When a problem comes up we have an entire forum section titled "Abuse and Theft Investigation" ATI for short dedicated to abuse logging. This has three purposes, the first is logging violations and warnings (AKA Abuse), The second, for discussion as to if a particular user or offence is banworthy or not and the third, Ban evasion tracking and logging. It is in this practice that it gets to be an issue.

Abuse log.
As with any ban the user dun screwed up, Now the entire point of the logging process is basic, it's meant to make the administration be absoutely certain that the ban reason is legitimate.

I'll use an actual log for an example here.

DA address: [link pulled]
User: - 11 - Docked points (three points per deletion = 27) - -16

- [link pulled] - Photo Manip
- [link pulled] - Photo manip
- [link pulled] - Photo manip
- [link pulled] - Innopropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - (736934) Rejected
- [link pulled] - Photo Manip
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Copy Vio
- [link pulled] - Inappropriate implied adult conduct
- [link pulled] - Screencap manipulation (Wiki)
- [link pulled] - Screencap manipulation (Wiki)

User is using Photo and 3D Renders for BG, Photo composes 75% or more of the image over all - Images deleted.

Additionally, I am unable to verify the authentisity of the 3D render used here

- [link pulled]

Last edited by Battou on 10 13 2009 22:02; edited 8 times in total

738535, 740431, 742956, 743989 and 743988 - New

Warning issued.

While I have no objections to these removals, this does set a precedent that may affect previous submissions.

So I guess we need to revise the submission policy? It's high time for that anyway.

While I have no objections to these removals, this does set a precedent that may affect previous submissions.

So I guess we need to revise the submission policy? It's high time for that anyway.

I know atleast a couple of them are a bit of a streach due to relitively mild content, I felt that this streach was validated by the individuals track record. I have seen and over looked quite a few images that could be considered pushing the boundries in the same manor as727744 and 74295, however the ones I overlooked came from users who had not previously breeched the boundry and where cut some slack. This user on the other hand has a gallery chalk full of homoerotic imagery and breeched now three different submission policies/guidlines with a possible fourth, so when he/she pushed the boundries they pushed back so to speak. It's not the homoerodic subject matter but the proven willingness of sexual contact depiction of the user seen in 736534 and 733338.

I don't have any qualms with amending the standards on sexual conduct, that is up to you. Drawing a line on things like this ain't easy, but I would kinda like to maintain a little leaway for a user to user basis and fluidity of said line.

I recieved Not one, but two separate reports filed for art theft by this user, One in support mail with in exccess fifty images linked and reported as potential theft. Just shortly ago I recieved a PM from a furaffinity user with another one literally uploaded this morning.

Hi, I know that you cant (C) a pose or anything, but I've come across a pic that looks like it has just been traced and recolored with a bg added:

[link removed]

Original:

[link removed]


The original is actually a piece I did myself and posted on a seperate site. I havent uploaded here in a while, but I do visit every once and a while and I came across the pic. I'm not sure if this counts as art theft or not, but if something can be done about it, I'd greatly appreciate it, thanks!

I apologize for not giving specific links for ever individual picture,
but there's too many violations here to do so. Each of these listed
have been directly lifted from my comic Housepets, and have been painted
over in photoshop.

You can see my site here: http://www.housepetscomic.com/ and just a few
comics back you can see obvious violations.

Here are several of my storylines in particular which have been ripped
off (not all listed comics fall into storylines though):
[5-links removed for space]

And some of my images which have been ripped off:
[2 links removed for space]

Artist in question:
http://www.fanart-central.net/profile-D ... re9494.php

Stolen/Painted Over Images:
[67-links removed for space]

The images I checked on all appear to be legitimate redraws on the pose but I don't have the patients to go and process all of them. Given this users track record I am just going to be done with her.

AA revoked, Photomanipulation - Adult conduct
[Battou - 1/26/2009]
See ATI thread
Link Here <--[removed]
[Battou - 1/26/2009]

AA Re-revoked - Adult content - screencap manipulation and photomanipulation
[Battou - 3/19/2009]

Account Terminated

One evasion account verifyed on Email registry

http://www.fanart-central.net/profile-Pinguin1234.php - Terminated.

^^^Pretty simple right, that is your standard issue copyright violation log.


To ban or not to ban discussion.
This is a simple practice that I am sure many forums practice so I will save some space in explaining it. This one leads right into the most irritating of all the logs.


Now we get into the trickey and most time consuming situations.....Ban Evasion tracking :cheer:

This is fairly self explanatory, evasion accounts and sockpuppet accounts (Multiple account to a user) need to be confirmed prior to processing. Confirmations can be made in a number of different ways that I am not willing to divulge, suffice it to say we can and will go beyond simple IP matching and registered E-mail addys because we needed to find other more accurate methoeds of confirming these accounts. We make a point to log all potential evasion accounts for confirmation, discussions and conversations with the evading user as well as any retaliatory actions taken.

Below is an excerpt from one such log from an actual inncodent, not all posts in this log are going to be brought out for a couple reasons, one of them is space.

One user decided one night it would be a grand idea to post inappropriate NSFW "goatse" imagery used in main site comments including (but not limited to) comments on imagery and profiles of all administrative personell.

Apparently she's trying to commit suicide via admin. Recent activities include goatse and ED porn in comments and profile page, uploading a color-swap of my avatar, and claiming she is trying to get banned because she's upset over RickRoll and RickAstley's bans.

Apologies that I do not have a screenshot of her profile page prior to moderating it.

I've taken the liberty of suspending her account pending PM contact with her, but even so, once I've heard her opinion on the matter I'm probably going to have to ban anyway.

(Side note: Please issue future bans from the RC domain, it has additional features and logs their IPs)

Ban complete, one of those goatse pics was posted on one of my more children oriented images.

http://www.fanart-central.net/pic-736174.html

View Deleted

I've been im PM contact with her in the past two days and specifically said that I didn't feel like banning her over this.

It was obviously a deliberate attempt at suicide-by-admin, perhaps as a prank, and since I've been in PM contact with her before I figured I'd at least discuss it over PM with her rather than drop the banhammer outright. Yes I was very offended, but a moment's hesitation and a day of PM discussion later and I didn't feel like banning.

Intriguingly, she started pleading for me to lift the suspension from her account since it was a prank suggested by a few online friends and it was her birthday and I told her flat out 'No', I wasn't going to do that.

I mean, if a police officer pulls someone over for driving drunk, they're gonna take that person downtown regardless of whatever.

I did already make clear to her that this was obviously a bannable offense and that if another admin decided to issue a ban then I would not complain.

http://www.fanart-central.net/profile-MandyMilne.php

Someone's going to get in worse trouble. She made another account.

hey, is this purplemoonlight006? (sorry if i got that a little wrong)

Yeah, my old account got banhammered cause I was being a total moron and stupid.

Sometimes when pounding nails into a coffin one needs to ask them selves, 'Who will be resting in it' before the final nail is pounded.

This one may be a zombie. Better weld it shut.

You remember when my friend got on my account and messed around?? That was on my KinkyKitten account.

Anyways similar incident happened again, Sheryl confessed it was her that posted those pictures while she and I were drunk and sleepless.

I took the blame because it was MY account and MY fault that I had left it signed in.

Even if we assume that Sheryl is not an imaginary friend being used as an escapegoat, that excuse is still moot as she is well aware that she is responsable for her account security. I smell little more than desperation there. I also fail to see any evidence of a lesson learned.

Even if we assume that Sheryl is not an imaginary friend being used as an escapegoat, that excuse is still moot as she is well aware that she is responsable for her account security. I smell little more than desperation there.

Yeah. I responded with a "you're telling me this NOW?". If that really is the case then it would've been easier to believe her had she admitted it straight-up. If she wants a second chance IMHO she can probably have one, but first she's got to pay for her first chance.

She has been PMing and begging all weekend, litterally filling my inbox. I accidently deleted all my messages instead of just the marked ones so I don't have them all, but here is the one I was replying to and my reply.

Please give me a second chance. I promise you won't regret it.
I find it unfair that I am being punished when it was my friend who did all of that on my account.
I was drunk that night and because of my mental illnesses I easily forget things which is why I keep forgetting to sign myself out and stuff.
I am not a troll, EdwardIsNotAmused is still on this site and she is a worse troll than I ever was, although I am not a troll. I can be mean sometimes but who isn't mean.
I find it unfair you let Ed stay but not give me a second chance.
I have put a password on my computer so no one can get on it but me.
Not that you care but this is stressing me out and this is not healthy for me. I am not sleeping or eating much or at all anymore. I had to go to the hospital twice already cause of it.

But like I said not like you guys care about that, that this is causing me to get sick. If I get worse I will have to stay at the hospital. But again not like you care. I bet you wouldn't even care if because of this that because I am not eating or sleeping and that I am seriously getting ill that I could die from it but not like you care. And for the record I am not being dramatic so don't think that. I am being serious here, it is why I keep writing PMs to you guys and because now I can't have a life. I was beginning to have a life but now I am stuck sitting here waiting for you site staff to talk to me and possibly give me a second chance.

Look, I have not been online for the last two days, further more I am rather busy.

Now, Listen, there is no excuse for your friend getting access to your account, plain pure and simple. You are responsable for any and all actions conducted from your account and that is documented in the Site policy.

Your excuses are falling on deaf ears and I will tell you why:

First, I am a Child Care provider for a living, I get paid to see to the appropriate care of well being of my clients. My clients have a direct line to my profile and gallery, That said, the potential for my clients to be subjected to the comments made from your account was there considering that one was made on an unfiltered image, had it just been the tinkerbell image things may have been different and I might have just left it to Strata but that was not the case. My actions where not only that of a site administrator but also that of a child welfare worker.


Second, I can not tell you howmany times I have accessed this site ineabriated to the point of inability to walk. Drunken behaivior does not excuse the actions that have been conducted. Having forgot to log out of your account holds no relevance to me as I never log out on this computer, despite that I have never had any instances of such blatent disrespect from any of the people who use this computer. Your choice of friends is to blame here. I suggest you seriously reavaluate your circle of friends.


Third, With my phsycology and socialogy background I take offence to people using mental illnesses to justify actions that have been conducted. My fiancée has been hospitalized several times for her fleet of mental illnesses and emotional disorders, this does not make her any different than any one else, nor does it entitle her to innapropriate behaivor or make her exempt to rules and laws. The same applies to any one with mental disorders. The line "The voices in my head made me do it" don't work on me, you are the decition maker in your life no one or nothing else is. The simptoms you have described are those of Bi-poler, manic depressent and anxiety. I would suggest looking to your past and finding out what it is that caused you to be so afraid of loosing something you hold dear as well as what it is that brought you to a point of such manic emotional shifting, I can tell you from experience they will all tie in together.

I do understand that an internet site can be a useful copeing aid, however if hospitalizeation has become necessary then perhaps there is more to your situation than you realize. I suggest you continue with the hospitalization and perhaps you can find the true source of your conditions as opposed to simply copeing with them.

It's not that I don't care, I do that that is required of me, as a site administrator I have to make sure the site users can understand and follow the site policy. As a child welfare worker I am required to see to it that my clients are not going to be subjected to material that is inapropriate for their age group by whatever meanes necessary. Finally as a man who is making great strides in helping a young woman overcome a severe case of bi-poler disorder and manic depression I know full well the consiquences of my actions. If you had any incling of what I have put my fiancée through in order to help her find and over come her sources, you would see my point clearly. "Some times the best places to go are the hardest places to reach". There are times when one has to be ruthless to teach something of importance, That is the definition of tough love. I am seriously beginning to feel that this will be better for you in the long run. Get whatever help you need and then come back and we'll go from there, but for the time being we'll keep the distraction away.

(Sorry, double post)
Also, this person says, they are "a friend of Mandy", and that she uses her computer frequently.
http://www.fanart-central.net/profile-B ... ainbow.php

Bleedingrainbow has already contacted me via PM.

Yes, she is back already.

And ed has another puppet too it seems: FJORDR


They just don't learn......

Predictably, I have a Note in my deviantArt inbox complaining about the IP block (from ****.deviantart.com)

My response:

I was not involved in the discussion of this recent incident, did not see the specific posts involved and did not know the particular range of addresses denis chose to block. However, judging by the aftermath as logged in our staff discussion area I will say this, at least one of them originated from your IP address or location.

So. I am sorry, there is nothing I can or will do about the IP block, that is how it must be. If somebody trolls from a shared IP address or proxy service then we simply must take action to defend ourselves and if by blocking that address or proxy we prevent uninvolved, innocent third parties from participating on our site then that is a price we are willing and eager to pay for eliminating a troll.

This is nothing personal, do not blame us for having to freakin' defend ourselves against people who are out to drag FAC down to the eight layer of Hell and below. We have declared war against troll accounts, our gloves are off and we are out for troll blood, we will NOT tolerate disruption or spamming any more and we WILL ban offenders on sight when it comes down to it.

Do you know any people by the screen names "theJoker" or "DarkAce101" ? DarkAce101 was the troll specifically behind that latest incident, and theJoker is currently walking a hairline between 'ignore' and 'ban' himself.

If you are not involved, then I would like to request that for your own protection, steer yourself clear of and forget about FAC entirely. It is just not safe.

I have always been the "good cop", the Mr. Nice Guy among FAC's three admins -- but right now, against the people who are attacking our site without end I cannot afford such mercies. This dragon has to put aside the Nice Guy, call in the "bad cop" for reinforcements, sharpen his claws and get ready to bite some heads off.

Again, I am sorry that it has had to come to this, we did not start this fight (nor do we want to) but we are damn well going to be the ones to finish it.

Not really certain, but I have a gut feeling it's Mandy again. 🙁
http://www.fanart-central.net/profile-A ... eld006.php
(I already checked IP, and didn't see related IP addresses as previous accounts, but I could have just done it wrong too.)

Ami's registered email address is purplemoonlight006@[Pulled].com .

Purple is pestering me a little bit on dA asking when/if she's allowed back on. I don't have an answer at this time beyond "not yet" but I did mention the new account for some confirmation.

Toasted again

Banned for:
Verbal assalt on site Staff
Comments as a means to strike another user
Comments as a means to strike the website it self
False or misleading accusations
Reciprocal attack
Ban evasion
Spamming/Flooding
Troll like behaivior


I'm seriously sick and tired of banning these two be they together or seperate. The truth of why I had not banned her before now was actually that I felt it was too much of a hassle to to so, she'll be back in a couple of hours anyway.

Banned for:
Verbal assalt on site Staff
Comments as a means to strike another user
Comments as a means to strike the website it self
False or misleading accusations
Reciprocal attack
Ban evasion
Spamming/Flooding
Troll like behaivior

How many of these are recent behavior?

Even after the suspension was lifted she continued to follow Ed like a lost puppy and jibber jabber reply to everything she posted. Look at all of the threads posted by Ed since the suspension was lifted, How many of those have two or three posts back and forth between both Ed and Ami before someone else has posted? The content may be different but the fact remains they are back and forthing with each other again. It's an unnecessary amount of posting cunducted in a manor they where specifically told not to by denis him self. But given the content difference I listed that as well as troll like behavior more in reguard of the preexisting ban reasons of witch she was at the time guilty of evading.

What problem do you got against me anyways? I didn't even do anything to you. It is like you got a total grudge against me because I just happen to be friends with Ed and that is not fair.

You know it is immature to have grudges against people who did NOTHING in the first place. Everyone says this place is run by children. Maybe you guys should just forget about FAC and delete the whole site.

verbal assult on site staff, Comments as a means to strike another user

[*]The statment "Everyone says this place is run by children." Is one, endorsing this kind of behavior and name calling, as a means of complaining about site staff and administrative actions, Two, who exactly are "They"? if I recall correctly the ones who started this "this place is run by children" where people who got banned for a reason and continued to get rebanned because they could not understand why they where banned and just resigned up and bashed the site. I can think of maybe four or five individuals being repeatedly banned at the time, Ed and Ami being two of them. As far as I am conserned they don't exist as she played her own part in coining the phrase.

[*]The comment "You know it is immature to have grudges against people who did NOTHING in the first place." was directed at me specifically. This comment most likely takes it's origin in the fact I processed the initial ban and I refused to give in to her petty excuses and flat out refused to retract the ban and continue to do so.


Reciprocal attack and False or misleading accusations:

[*]In the thread that quote was taken from, she very quickly followed any post made by administration with statments accusing site staff of doing their jobs incorrectly and unjustly stating again they where banned with out reason. As you are well aware their bans do have a reason, this reason is in black and white easy to read text stating that ban evasion is a banworthy offence and the initial ban was processed on the reason of innapropriate NSFW "goatse" imagery used in main site comments. This constitutes an attack on site staff, Am I incorrect in this assessment?

[*]The statement "Everyone says this place is run by children." Strata How old are you, I assumed you are right about my age, I could be wrong but still, You are legally an adult correct, I know I am, I know Denis is, I know London is and I know Jaymes is. Even if you are not by law an adult and we rule out all but the three admin, Denis and I both being adults derails the entire statement of the site being run by children. That said by default that statement is a misleading accusation. I know you prolly did not have that in mind when you added these two clauses to the user conduct policy but such accusations can not be condoned.


Comments as a means to strike the website it self

The statement "Maybe you guys should just forget about FAC and delete the whole site." is pretty self explanatory.


All of that was in one post made just a few hours ago.

...and [Ami's] initial ban was processed on the reason of innapropriate NSFW "goatse" imagery used in main site comments.

I was willing to excuse that on the grounds that it was a drunken prank. Of course, I type that sentence in the past-tense for a reason, and it does not excuse anything else; this "grudge" she likes to mention really is just a wishful term for the obligation to enforce the non-temporary nature of a ban.

So I've got to agree with you here. When she used the term "second chance" in some PM discussion I told her up front that she's more like having spent her third and fourth chances already. She doesn't get another.

That is a pain in the ass to put it bluntly, and just think, this is one of the more resent cases and also one with the a smaller number of confirmed problematic evasion accounts, We have one persistant user confirmed to have well over thirty confirmed and rumored to have over sixty unconfirmed but still other wie banned sockpuppets.

Would you want to do that every day?

 

[Umbreon]

Im not scared to ban but when it comes to IP ban for members that have been on our site for a while, then i get scared.

 

[Cosmic]

I think to think of a ban as a shield rather than a sword. If a member has malicious intent or is doing more damage to the community than good then said user should be banned. If they are just misguided then they should be prod in the right direction and if they resist to hardly then eventually banned. But if the user has no good intentions and just wants to spam, then yes, they should be immediately banned. that's my take on bans. 🙂

 

[Fergal]

Thanks for that Battou, there is some very helpful info there.

 

[Dasher]

[Insert extremely long post here]

Nice Battou. You keep on banning.

 

[Sparkz]

I just baned a member. He thanked me for knoking sense into him. No lies.